Can we all be happy in the same society?
When asked if there is a possibility of a Utopian society that satisfies everyone my gut reaction is to say no, just because of the different way everyone sees the world as well as their values. A quintessential part of life for us in this world is experiencing challenges and learning how to adapt and overcome them. Whether this is a small thing when we are young, like learning how to share, or a bigger thing when we are older, like working with difficult people at a job these experiences help us grow as people. Although in the moment these obstacles are unpleasant and we wish to just always be happy there is a gratification we get from overcoming things and learning how to handle situations. In theory, in a utopian society we would always get what we want, this would mean when we are 3 and want ice cream for breakfast we would get it, we would never have to learn how to deal with the emotions of not getting that ice cream. Therefore, we wouldn’t emotionally mature in the same way we are now. Although this might not seem so bad if we always get what we want who cares if we are emotionally mature? I think we get more gratification from dealing with a problem than just not having one.
The question about having a society where freedom and equality can coexist is an interesting one. I think greed and jealousy are, unfortunately, traits that everyone experiences and this is something that can interfere with a completely equal society. I think if there is a possibility of someone being able to have what they see as a better life the will strive for it and in turn, this will bring someone else done. Therefore, the only way to have everyone be happy with a hierarchical society would be to raise them/pre-program them differently than how we currently see life, like in Brave New World. However, that is then taking away freedom by somewhat controlling how people think and what they decide to do with their life. So in conclusion, because of the elements human nature that we experience now there isn’t a possibility for equality, and to change human nature would take away freedom.
The question about having a society where freedom and equality can coexist is an interesting one. I think greed and jealousy are, unfortunately, traits that everyone experiences and this is something that can interfere with a completely equal society. I think if there is a possibility of someone being able to have what they see as a better life the will strive for it and in turn, this will bring someone else done. Therefore, the only way to have everyone be happy with a hierarchical society would be to raise them/pre-program them differently than how we currently see life, like in Brave New World. However, that is then taking away freedom by somewhat controlling how people think and what they decide to do with their life. So in conclusion, because of the elements human nature that we experience now there isn’t a possibility for equality, and to change human nature would take away freedom.
-Nicole Southey
I agree that there is probably no way to have a perfect Utopia for everybody in a society. Everybody is so different and would want different things to make them happy, that other people wouldn’t want. Though, there is something appealing about living in a society where you get everything you want, even ice cream for breakfast.
ReplyDeleteI agree that given our nature, there isn't a way to create an egalitarian society without restricting our freedom. As I was thinking about what would be in a true utopian society, I kept on coming across the problem of human nature. Without laws, there would undoubtedly be disorder. Although you could encourage people to not steal, etc., there would still be a minority that would go against these guidelines. Even with laws, people still commit crimes. There is no way to ensure that everyone behaves in a virtuous way unless, like you mentioned, everyone was engineered to behave that way.
ReplyDeleteI didn't think we could ever create a utopian society because I thought that no one would be able to agree on everything. There would always be someone who disagreed and there's the problem of things like greed. You make a good point about how if we managed to create a utopia, we would always get whatever we wanted and that might not be the best thing. I agree that you feel better when you are able to overcome a problem rather than not having a problem at all. I don't know if there would really be a need to have a hierarchy in a utopian society. If you could pre program them like in BNW then you could just raise them so that they wouldn't have traits like greed. Then without those, you could have a utopia where everyone was equal.
ReplyDeleteI agree that we get more gratification from overcoming problems instead of simply not having any. Your point about how maturing emotionally is important reminded me of Soma from BNW. Although Soma was supposed to be a utopian element that prevented people from feeling negative emotions, like rage or sadness, I always felt that soma wasn't an ideal solution because I thought that people needed to experience those emotions in order to grow. Similarly, I agree with you that it is important that humans experience feelings of greed and jealousy because they also contribute to a person's development.
ReplyDeleteI think that maybe a true utopia is impossible, where everyone is content and no conflict exists, but I think that it might be possible to get close. I expect there will always be conflict, but I think it's likely that we will be able to be generally happy with the same society eventually. Maybe even that is impossible, but I hope that it isn't, because I hope that we really can get better.
ReplyDelete-Sasha
As you said, achieving a true uptopia is impossible for the reason that human nature wouldn't allow it. This argument also applies to many aspects of the books we have read so far. For example, their focuses on stability over advancement are apalling, yet both books have had worlds where that is the case, despite it going aganst human nature. I think this is to be expected from all utopian books, as all utopias are actually dystopias. There is no merit in a world fully equal, because that would mean rewriting human nature itself, something you cover. For that reason, I think you are fully right in saying "because of the elements of human nature that we experience now there isn’t a possibility for equality."
ReplyDeleteAchieving an utopian society would be incredibly difficult, and I agree that emotions and feelings of individuals may get in the way of that, since a utopia is different for everyone. I especially agree with your statement "I think we get more gratification from dealing with a problem than just not having one." If we didn't have problems, then we wouldn't learn, we wouldn't move society forward, the world would be stagnant and boring, and that within itself is not a utopia. Good post!
ReplyDeleteAn interesting concept that someone once told me was this idea that happiness is a zero sum game. Essentially, the happiness of one leads to an equal and opposite sadness in others. There is some merit to this idea because almost everything in our lives are relative. Money is relative to the amount there is total. You could have 500,000$ but if inflation made that amount of money worthless you don't really have anything. Also, you might be talented at an instrument, but if the people around you are better than you, you're not really talented are you? Basically, I think the many examples of how things are relative and comparative in this world lends itself to the idea that perhaps happiness is a zero-sum game and the idea that everyone can be happy in the same society is absurd.
ReplyDeleteIn some cases, it is zero-sum. The parent's righteous refusal of ice cream is the 3-year-old's misery, and the 3-year-old's sugar buzz is the parent's defeat (and the child's possible stomachache). I hesitate at calling it always a zero-sum game because there are things that do make everyone happy, like enough food, water, safety, and shelter to live as they see fit. Moral needs and wants are harder to identify and address equally, but perhaps a utopia just provides the basics and lets the rest be a zero-sum game. It really is a messy concept, though. In both BNW and HMT everyone has basic human rights, it's the "living as they see fit" that's a problem. But who is the arbiter of moral correctness (besides the people who design hypnopaedic brainwashing)?
DeleteI mean, a Utopia is just a concept - no one actually knows what one looks like. Also, everyone's perspectives and needs are different like you said, so its impossible to have a unanimous vote of happiness across a large population. The only thing we can really strive for is closer to perfection.
ReplyDeleteI think we can live in the same society. We would just have to worry about individual personalites, which is something we already do. Now the concept of a Utopian society is all based on perspective. I wonder if we could make a Utopian society where no one goes hungry and there is no war.
ReplyDeleteThere is a possibility for equality, but it inevitably results in individual freedoms being lost (look at communist experiments around the world) since equality and individual freedoms are at odds with each other. Humans are individuals with different perceptions of what is good and bad, so freedom is much more important to me since equality will result in a society that limits personal experiences because people are naturally unequal. So I would agree that a utopia is practically impossible. Now, if everyone were to be happy in Brave New World (this is not the case), would that be a utopia? I think it depends on what you consider to be the ultimate goal of life (happiness, usefulness, life is meaningless, etc?).
ReplyDeleteI agree, a true utopia would be one deprived of individual freedoms. In order to force equality, one must change human nature, which to some is an infringement of their individual freedoms. To complicate this further, every member of society perceives their fulfillment of happiness differently. To some, all they need is to have a purpose in life; others, on the other hand, require more extravagant luxuries in order to be content with their position in life. It is impossible to fulfill every want without negatively affecting others, which basically destroys any possibility of creating a true utopia that appeals to everyone.
ReplyDeleteFor every gain you make towards creating one, there will always be an equal trade-off.
Another aspect of this discussion is the difficulty of so many people. When discussing utopias in the form of politics and society it's tough cause everyone has different visions. This is one explanation for why utopian communes exist and have so much trouble growing and surviving.
ReplyDeleteThis was a really good post, Nicole. I liked how you brought up the point that we actually get satisfaction from the fact that we overcome difficult situations. We naturally feel better and happier when we do something good when it was hard to do, because we grow to be better people and that makes us feel better than if we had just given into doing the wrong thing.
ReplyDeleteEverybody has different interests and desires. I find it would be hard to satisfy everyone even in a utopia. The definition of a utopia differs from person to person. For everyone to be happy, everyone would have to be the same. So wouldn't Brave New World's system of reproduction make everyone happy? I would also say no to this question. If everyone is experiencing the same life the same way, I don't think anyone will know what true happiness really is.
ReplyDelete